Succession PC: Mal

[Pegasus]

Hi all!

Mal has killed his pc here

He is asking for a succession package for his new pc as per this guide

Please could you choose one option for which succession package you feel is appropriate. In order to ensure that the pc is not kept waiting, I am going to keep this poll open for 5 days - until 1st August.

Thanks. Please feel free to discuss below:

[Incubus]

Although his random death kind of irks me considering how much mod time he consumed of mine the past few weeks regarding future Mal plots, I think 30XP +5 knowledge is appropriate.

[Nymph]

I voted for Option B and I wish to bring it to the attention to everyone as to why I have done so.

The following warning was issued to this user
» /viewtopic.php ... 640#p18535
Removed access from the Adult Forum. Player would like to argue rules and blame staff for their mistake. They would not adhere to the suggested options and refused to bend to the rules of the game.

Jade issued a warning on October 12, 2016 to Mal. His Adult Forum privileges were revoked and I believe remain revoked. Although we have seen improvement through the course of the year on Mal, he has already begun to show signs of repetition by disrespecting me and my work in AJAX chat. I have attached several examples below to justify this.

It has come to the point that in the creation of Aelune, he has switched gears because he did not like something I said. He originally wanted to make his Naer transgendered. That has since changed even though I was working with him on the concept and attempting to help him with the illusion form of his Naer. He also asked that I permit him to put placeholders in Ymiden so that he could reap the benefits of Ymiden's wages. When I told him no, he elected to move to Scalvoris. That is his prerogative, but to follow it up with concepts like "Augiery is boring" in AJAX chat directly to me and to other mods like Djinn is disrespectful. Especially since the information I have been working so hard on hasn't even gone up yet.

(15:17:23) Nymph: (whispers to Aelune) I am working on a PM to you now.
(15:17:32) Aelune: (whispers) Thanks.
(15:17:44) Aelune: (whispers) Btw you killed chat. You monster.

The above excerpt was sent to the advocates. I had asked Aelune to speak in English (I believe he was speaking German at the time). At this time, Aelune was telling everyone that he/she was new. When I followed up asking if they had alts, they went radio silent. New or old, I do not appreciate being called a monster when I don't know you.

Two nights ago, with Djinn and Harpy (I think) present, he mentioned that Augiery was boring and would be starting in Scalvoris. I do not have the excerpts from this as I was incredibly infuriated at that time. The following was said to Djinn in chat during conversations where Aelune was assuming information that will be available come this weekend.

(15:54:23) Aelune: Well that's one way to make Augiery even more uninteresting.
(15:54:54) Djinn: Just because it doesn't allow you easy shit doesn't make it uninteresting, bud.
(15:54:56) Aelune: There's at least a way for Naer to travel coming out right?

He is already looking to min/max this character. There is much I have to clarify about the shadow form of the Naerrik given his questions since there are light sources practically everywhere in Idalos. I have had to turn over this case to the Advocates because it is eternally frustrating to me.

He deserves something given the longevity that he has stayed at ST. Beyond the 20 additional points, I do not believe that he deserves much more. On top of that, the warning needs to be transferred to the new PC. He should not be permitted to run away from that.

This may seem like I am out to get him, and maybe I am clouded due to the insults that he has given to my work and the fact he wants me to give him more than other places. Special treatment should not be tolerated. Remarks as such should not be tolerated. Warnings should be considered in succession PCs.

Please feel free to ask me for further information here or in Skype. As is always, the majority vote is what we will go by and I will respect that. I just ask that you all consider what I have said here.

[Harpy]

I'd have to agree with Nymph, here. I was present for the last incident on Aelune where he insulted Nymph, and he doesn't seem to really have shown remorse - more apologised because Djinn made him do so.

[Maltruism]

I had already hit the "Option C" button before I realized there were new issues with Mal.
I have had no real problem with him myself, and he has contributed significantly to Etzos' fun.
Maybe I have a soft spot for him, because of it.
Nonetheless, I understand your motivation to post your complaints with him.

I don't want this to sound as unsympathetic as it might - it's so hard to put feelings into straight text - but if we were going to use this to punish him, I'd say deny him altogether then. I say that because I don't see the separation between option B and C as really constituting a clear indication of favor or disfavor.

But to be honest, I'd like to see this Succession program kept separate from Advocacy issues anyway. I don't want our first Succession to be touched by something that might get misconstrued. And Hell, he can always be banned again on his new PC if he gets snide about it. He should definitely have his past warnings follow him on his new PC.

[Incubus]

I agree with Jeff here. While his comments were rude, I don't honestly think Succession bonuses should be determined by Advocacy issues or personality issues in general - I think the PC's longevity and various PC related factors should determine the bonus, at least for me.

[Whisper]

I can see both sides of this but am erring on the side of Nymph here, and that is the way I have voted. He has targeted a number of moderators here and whenever something doesn't go his way he throws a shitfit.

Maybe it's petty to involve disciplinary issues into something that is purely character-based but it's how I feel.

The sudden death doesn't help the matter either.

[Anomaly]

I haven't voted yet, but I'd like to say that I also can see both sides of the argument and will abstain from voting for a moment because I have a couple of thoughts about it.

Firstly, no matter how many alts he makes in the future or has, now, all his warnings should automatically carry with him as long as there's cause for concern on the side of the staff. He's still been abusive within the limits of the site's rules and we've had troubles with him on numerous occasions, even if he's been generally improving on the side and has been a largely positive presence in the community at large (from what I've seen of him in Chat on a good day). He's invested and active, and that's well and good. So long as there's cause for concern about his behaviour, though, his warnings and disciplinary notes shouldn't be forgotten and should continue to jump from PN to PN thread (basically posting a link to the original warning in the Prophet Notes of all subsequent characters he has that are confirmed as his) until such a time where we feel he's improved enough that there's no more cause for concern.

Beyond that... Maybe we should hold on the matter of the Succession PC and inquire more into why he's so suddenly abandoning Mal and give it a little bit of extra time... since, considering how suddenly this happened, it's entirely possible that he's going to change his mind in a few days and be grouchy and unhappy about his spur of the moment decision. So, instead of treating the succession PC matter, speak to him about why the character was killed and what we can do to help him sort out those issues. If he's still dead-set on his character being killed off after those conversations, then go ahead with the retirement and vote on the Succession PC matter, but to hold it off for a few days and reach out to him first. You know, just in case this is something he'll regret doing. He has shown that he has a habit of flip-flopping on what he wants to do in the past, and even in regards to his newest alt.

TL;DR: We should probably talk to him about why he's unhappy with Mal, since it seems like a reactive, kneejerk and spur-of-the-moment decision to kill him off, and make sure it's not a reaction to unrelated discontent before we move forward with treating it like a Succession matter.

[Jade]

Staff, this isn't about your personal feelings for Mal. It's about rewarding his new character for the effort put into the old one. If you don't like the choices, don't vote.

[Rumour]

Hi team,

First, I'd like to apologize for coming out of my mini-break solely to reply to this thread. I understand that I have a lot of threads, messages, and PMs to reply to at the moment, and I promise I will address those when I have some time & energy.

Second, thank you everyone for weighing in and providing your POV. I think this raises some good discussion about Succession Packages and how we need to approach them going forward, especially since this is the very first player requesting a Succession Package (the last request was made by a staff member on the PSF).

Before I get into it, I'd like to clear up a few things:

• 1. Mal was given access to the Adult Forum after he recently petitioned Jade and the Advocate team. The warning has remained on his account, which he is aware of.
  
  2. Warnings have not carried forward with new accounts in the past unless the player was banned. Typically, when we give someone a warning, we give it to their character account rather than all of their accounts across the board. If this is something we want to do for all players going forward (not just Mal), please make this a suggestion in a new thread in the Advocate forum. I would strongly recommend that if this is the decision, then we also provide a clear & transparent way for players to have their warnings removed.

From a succession package standpoint, I could not agree more with Maltruism & Incubus:

But to be honest, I'd like to see this Succession program kept separate from Advocacy issues anyway. I don't want our first Succession to be touched by something that might get misconstrued.

I agree with Jeff here. While his comments were rude, I don't honestly think Succession bonuses should be determined by Advocacy issues or personality issues in general - I think the PC's longevity and various PC related factors should determine the bonus, at least for me.

Succession Packages were not created to punish or reward OOC behavior. They should be based on: how the character death occurred, length of time playing, post count, and other character-related factors (per the guide). They are not connected to account warnings, personal opinions or feelings about a player, or whether or not we think they’re a good person. If the plan is to use these packages to punish or reward players based on how we feel about them in an OOC capacity or how well they have treated staff members, then my vote is that we scrap the idea of Succession Packages entirely because the chance of being accused of bias and favouritism is extremely high.

I’d like to make a request that folks do not vote for Succession Packages based on personal opinion or OOC standing of a person. This is a character-based reward for players who put a lot of time and effort into their character & allowed them to be killed. If you feel the death was rushed or hurried or not appropriate for the plot, then that’s absolutely a reason to vote for smaller succession package. If you feel the player is disrespectful OOC, that is an Advocate issue and should be dealt with separately from the succession package. These are not connected and should not be connected because of the very high potential for bias and favouritism.

This is not to minimize Mal's behaviour. Disrespecting staff/players on the site or breaking ToU is never okay. I do think, however, that this is not the appropriate forum for airing personal complaints about his OOC behaviour or attitude. If you have concerns about Mal's behaviour as a player, please speak to the Advocate team via PM.

Thanks for understanding, all.